Heaven on earth, anyone?

[cindyprism]

It seems to me like anything with a bunch of followers has at least one kernel of truth behind it, somehow. I remember my mom telling me when I was little about some people (Mormons, maybe? Whatever.) who believe when we die, we go off to new planets, where we and eventually others will come live too, when they die.

So I was just thinking it wouldn't seem necessary to go off to a whole new planet when we've got a beautiful one right here. It has a lot of battle scars and weird problems, but I for one love trying to solve problems. When I'm not at least helping to solve problems of some sort that seem at least halfway important, I get bored. It's a curse, boredom continually chasing me. Thank god for Comedy Central.

Anyway, I was also thinking it wouldn't seem necessary to actually die before this happens. It seems dying out of our old ways of thinking would be plenty sufficient.

So maybe that's what was behind this religion that made people think it sounded so very good, somehow. Yes, I do believe it must have been at least one of the things -- it would sound good to me too. Just a passing thought. Three cheers to whatever religion that is / was!

[Grave]

hip hip hurray, hip hip hurray, hip hip hurray

[lizanne333]

Prism, Grave, Dwayne, Edinia, Webmaster, et al

From what I am currently experiencing, certainly heaven
is not a place and yet it is. I guess that would be
called a paradox, no?

The only way we as human beings experience heaven
or hell is inside of our bodies, at this time. In fact,
right now, all of our experiences occur insde ourselves,
do they not?

All we touch, smell/taste, see, hear, (isn't there another
one?, whoops!) and think- occurs in this finely tuned instrument that we are.

I would like to suggest that, and it has been said
again and again, AWARENESS is the key.
"Just to KNOW who is driving,
what a help that would be". Moody Blues

So, I think science is now discovering that; in fact
our entire organism is both a transmitter and a
receiver.

Last night, and on many occasions, I noticed a
tingling sensation in my hands, on the top of my
head-a perceived vibration, if you will (how I
dislike that overworn phrase). As I lay on my
bed, and tuned in, I became aware that my entire
body was vibrating, subtly.

From my vision, received from Ervin Laszlow, I am
becoming awarethat all the cells of my body
are "talking" to each other, doing a "flight check"
and am excited to see what other communication is
going on unbeknownst to my RAM (on top consciousness).

As we become more fully integrated, more whole
organisms; I think we may find the distinct levels
of consciousness within us, i.e., unconscious, sub-
conscious, etc. begin to disappear, a more fluid
communication between all of these levels that
we used to think as distinct and separate will
occur.

In fact, I maintain, there NEVER was any separation between the levels of consciousness; it was our perception, hence our
understanding that had not evolved enough to
perceived the oneness/wholeness that we are.

We are and always have been whole, and
now science is giving us its' stamp of approval,
allowing us to "see" just how WHOLEY
we are!

Good books re: the heaven is here issue, would be:

GNOSTIC GOSPELS-Elaine Pagels

BEYOND BELIEF-Elaine Pagels

In these books, Elaine Pagels takes translated material
from the Nag Hammadi Scrolls, Dead Sea Scrolls, The
Gospel of Thomas, etc., information "lost" for 2,000
years, when a group of "knowing" Christ followers
were stamped out, as they were a threat to
Constantine's (CE 325) need for control in his empire.

Within one of these scrolls, I believe it was The
Gospel of Thomas, Thomas states, and I am paraphrasing here: "The Kingdom of Heaven is
inside of you, and outside of you. It is spread at your
feet...." .

We just haven't been able to "see" it.

As our intellect grows, (it seems to be catching up
with what has always been), we begin to become
more fully "present" in our bodies, have a greater
appreciation of the tremendous priviledge we have
available to us- this life.

In light of the above, my face flushes with embarassment, and a bit of shame, as my ignorance
flies forward in my face.

You see, I was one "who thought I knew, was
certain I knew, fought for what I knew, I knew",
only to find out, well......that I sure had a lot
of errors on my hard drive!

Never thought it possible for me to experience a
"true humility", well, the light has hit the fan my
friends, Thank-God, it is revealing all that we
thought was hidden, both within ourselves, and
outside ourselves!

Time to clean house, get with the program here,
clear up past events, some so convoluted, that your only choice is allow the light to expose it.

This is how we learn humility. Better now then
later, right?

If we don't clean our clocks, we cannot progress.
You will feel torn, part of you knowing, seeing and reaching for the freedom of the light, but conflicts of the past are pulling us back.

One could also say, "just let gooooooooooooooo
of what you think is true in order to find out what is
so!
Eventually, we will find we have the need to do this
from day to day, moment to moment. It becomes
an adventure, funnnnnnn!, the great, new knowing
from moment to moment to moment.

just a ramblin on
Lizanne

[lizanne333]

And now that we know that we are that which we
have been waiting for-

How do we practically apply this awareness?

In fact do we DO anything?

Or does it just unfold before us?

I'm inclined to think it is the latter.
Isn't that the magic of it all? ;D

Spontaneously, when one knows, heaven unfolds
before us?

Whaddya think?

Lizanne

[Grave]

lizanne333 said:

Prism, Grave, Dwayne, Edinia, Webmaster, et al

From what I am currently experiencing, certainly heaven
is not a place and yet it is.

Hi Lizzane, (difficult questions)

Very True, Heaven is not a place.

1) Neither there is a proof that this earth is(except our belief that creates it may be) . I guess then it doesn’t make much of a difference if we stop calling earth as a place or describe heaven as a place. Either way you'd be right.

Do all the places exist in mind?(Einstein on this belief introduced quantum theory- Whatever exist is because we think[this place])

A new question comes up.. Is Mind creating Matter? Science is researching on it, though it is already concluded by Buddha, "What is, is because you are"
-------------------------------------------------------------------

lizanne333 said:

The only way we as human beings experience heaven
or hell is inside of our bodies, at this time. In fact,
right now, all of our experiences occur inside ourselves,
do they not?

May be I'd like to believe: Heaven and hell is inside our Universal MIND(S) than Bodies. (MIND doesn't need space exist. So, may be its not possible to have a Mind INSIDE MATTER(BODY).
Because of Mind, we are experiencing this body.
(I could be wrong, this is a recollection of learning that I have had through mind. Now, if some one wants to know about me, I talk about what I am by talking about what I think I am(personality strengths and weaknesses that exist in my mind. not in my body )
-----------------------------------------------------------

lizanne333 said:

All we touch, smell/taste, see, hear, (isn't there another
one?, whoops!) and think- occurs in this finely tuned instrument that we are.

This is very interesting and is being already debated by philosophers.

a) Some say that the sensations happens inside our body where mind supposedly is.

b) And some say Body is actually fine tuned to receive and transmit information(sensation experience) from and to mind. For example your favorite Soap opera is not actually happening inside the television, the action is transmitted from T.V station. Television is the medium from which we experience the emotion of actors)

Personally, I go with the second option here(For now).

lizanne333 said:

On many occasions, I noticed a
tingling sensation in my hands, on the top of my
head-a perceived vibration. As I lay on my
bed, and tuned in, I became aware that my entire
body was vibrating, subtly.

YEA, happened with me too, its stopped now.

--------------------------------------------------------

lizanne333 said:

In fact, I maintain, there NEVER was any separation between the levels of consciousness; it was our perception

TRUE

lizanne333 said:

This is how we learn humility. Better now then
later, right?

"Better now than later" certainly sounds better, but I wonder if this means anything as such universally. We are creating our own time and eternity. It doesn't matter how we play. does it?

We can can progress as soon as we "WISH" or stop creating an illusion that we are "Growing". we are "Grown".. just palyin

But mostly, it depends on how you want to think.. and what role your mind is making you play this lifetime

Grave(Wonderful thoughts..thank you)

[Grave]

lizanne333 said:

And now that we know that we are that which we
have been waiting for-

How do we practically apply this awareness?

In fact do we DO anything?

Or does it just unfold before us?

I'm inclined to think it is the latter.
Isn't that the magic of it all? ;D

Spontaneously, when one knows, heaven unfolds
before us?

Whaddya think?

Lizanne

The later is true as much as the first (Freedom from choice) .. this is a weired answer that I don't know how to explain yet... but I know I feel this...

[Dwayne]

Cindyprism says:

"it wouldn't seem necessary to go off to a whole new
planet when we've got a beautiful one right here."

If most would agree then there would be no problem here in this, eh?


C also offers:

"Thank god for Comedy Central."

And for "Whose Line Is It Anyway".


~Dwayne~

[cindyprism]

I'm not finding myself particularly interested anymore in trying to figure out whether "heaven" is actually something outside or inside or neither or both or now or later or whatever. To me, heaven is goodness and fun that I love, given to me by something I feel I can trust. And I allow myself to experience it here & now in whatever ways it seems I'd most like to at the moment, guided by instincts that seem continuously sharper. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong -- at least I get to feel like I've experienced heaven, while many spend whole lifetimes waiting around for it, hoping they'll get in.

[Dwayne]

[glow=orange,2,300]Lizanne suggests:[/glow]

[glow=LimeGreen,2,300]"Time to clean house, get with the program here, clear up past events, some so convoluted, that your only
choice is allow the light
to expose it."[/glow]

[glow=orange,2,300]Wise words, my friend. Courageous, too.

When a totally dark room & a fully bright one are across from one another & the doors to each are opened: the room full of light continues to shine on with little diminishing while the dark room brightens noticably.





~Dwayne~



[/glow]

[Grave]

cindyprism said:

I'm not finding myself particularly interested anymore in trying to figure out whether "heaven" is actually something outside or inside or neither or both or now or later or whatever. To me, heaven is goodness and fun that I love

Me too. And to grow?

Grave(imagining)

[cindyprism]

Grave:
And to grow, I for one continually try to be as honest & imaginative as I can possibly be, at least about whatever feels worthy. Absolute honesty & unfathomable leaps of imagination not only result in what feels like real growth, but are what for me makes life worth living. Richard Bach's work reminds me of this better than anyone's.

[Grave]

cindyprism said:

Grave:
And to grow, I for one continually try to be as honest & imaginative as I can possibly be, at least about whatever feels worthy. Absolute honesty & unfathomable leaps of imagination not only result in what feels like real growth, but are what for me makes life worth living. Richard Bach's work reminds me of this better than anyone's.

...then I can conclude that we should do what we like, may not be right !...


Grave( having fun)

[peter]

ANYFISH? I think that is the only valid way we can agree. fish? heaven.. simple. anything else? isnt fish.... thanks for letting me fish with you...

[lizanne333]

RE: Fish/fishing

...as long as it is catch and release that which you do not
intend to eat! Whoooops! slupppp! "What was that?
Would somebody please remove the lure from the back
of my neck!"

Have been away awhille, growing, growing. Ow! and
Wow! Both draining and exhilarating!

Coming to recognize here that our spirits have arisen
out of the River of Spiritual Consciousness, wanting or needing (dependent upon the plan/need of Another)
to experience life in Form.
So, (and as I can only speak from my own experience
here) I took upon my spirit a cloak of matter, a vehicle through and in which I could experience the sensing
of other forms of spirit, also cloaked in matter.

At first I wondered, "where am I? Something's missing.
What IS this longing, what is this emptiness inside."

At this point, and still, I am not fully integrated into
the form provided me.

I started upon a journey-a journey to find out-either
something I forgot, or something that was missing.

Years of confusion, consternation, hopelessness,
trial and error, my journey, though interesting upon
review, still is not complete, fulfilling, by my standards.

And then one day, I could stand it no longer, the pain,
the suffering, without understanding why?

Turns out I was not the only one experiencing this
drama. In fact the suffering was common to just about
everyone else to greater or lesser degrees.

Everyone was having difficulty bringing forth the spirit
they were, into all aspects of their bodies.

Sooo....hence, forth from the River of Spiritual Consciousness came One with the information we needed
to find our way back to the River of Spritual Consciousness
from whence we sprung; but alas, many of us, in fact
most of us had become so enamored with our senses
that measure external experience, that we had difficulty
accessing our own starved, emaciated spirits within.

Even though roadmaps have been written, and Many
have tried; and are trying to get through the now
toughened veneer, we, in our ignorance, born of
a disconnectedness to our souls, display our incomprehension upon our faces.

We hurt; but know not how to heal ourselves. When
the cure is offered, we cannot recognize it, let alone
implement it. Generation upon generation has buried
the truth in zip format and archived it!

And then one day I heard the Messiah by George
Frederick Handel.

Downloaded and manifested by him/Him in 3 days!
Hmmmm! 3 days=Good Friday, Saturday, and Easter
Sunday. Interesting! Death/Resurrection 3 days.

One of the recitives goes: ".....Yet in thy flesh shall I
see God, yet in thy flesh........shall I see God!"

Well, hmm, I began to think on this. What could this
mean. Let's take a look at the flesh, you know that
which encapsulates us, ah! maybe DNA/and or genes?

Or could it mean that inside our flesh is the Spirit we
are and also that misplaced, dusty Spirit from which
we sprang?? How will we know, unless we go inside
to investigate.

Let us go there this week and post what we discover.

What else could it mean?



From one fish to a lure....oh you flash so brightly, and I
always hit upon bright flashes for food, but last time
I hit, well something strange happened to me. A sharp
pain took me into some place I had never been before.
It was a short trip, but exhilarating. Flesh surrounded
me, another sharp pain and I am swimming again.
Strange, my mouth hurts alot! I think I was abducted!
I hear a lot of that has been going on lately.

Ya know, don't think I will hit that flash again. Hmmm
can't trust the source of my sustenance. Now what?

Hey you! Come out of thy grave and speak of your
experience.

And you my Friend Dwayne, as always,

Truly, I am yours

Lizanne