|
Post by lizanne333 on Jun 16, 2005 22:31:59 GMT -5
thanks ange,
once again, i misconstrued, oh well, whatever else is new.
|
|
|
Post by eponine1971 on Jun 16, 2005 22:37:30 GMT -5
Ange,
My marriage was an abusive one that came from one surrender after another. I don't blame you for not knowing that. I am now in a relationship that is dance we all dream of. Together and apart, advances and retreats, but always knowing that love is there to provide the music. Funny thing happened to me the other day. I grew up in the 80's so there's a lot of stupid music that comes along with that.... (oh micky you're so fine, you're so fine you blow my mind) But I happened to sit down and actually read the words of a song by Simple Minds. It's called Alive and Kicking. I never bothered to learn the lyrics before. I liked the song but never thought it had such a beautiful and insightful philosphy.
You turn me on, you lift me up And like the sweetest cup I'd share with you You lift me up, don't you ever stop, I'm here with you Now it's all or nothing 'Cause you say you'll follow through You follow me, and I, I, I follow you What you gonna do when things go wrong? What you gonna do when it all cracks up? What you gonna do when the Love burns down? What you gonna do when the flames go up? Who is gonna come and turn the tide? What's it gonna take to make a dream survive? Who's got the touch to calm the storm inside? Who's gonna save you? Alive and Kicking Stay until your love is, Alive and Kicking Stay until your love is, until your love is, Alive Oh you lift me up to the crucial top, so I can see Oh you lead me on, till the feelings come And the lights that shine on But if that don't mean nothing Like if someday it should fall through You'll take me home where the magic's from And I'll be with you What you gonna do when things go wrong? What you gonna do when it all cracks up? What you gonna do when the Love burns down? What you gonna do when the flames go up? Who is gonna come and turn the tide? What's it gonna take to make a dream survive? Who's got the touch to calm the storm inside? Don't say goodbye Don't say goodbye In the final seconds who's gonna save you? Oh, Alive and Kicking Stay until your love is, love is, Alive and Kicking Oh, Alive and Kicking Stay until your love is, love is, Alive and Kicking
|
|
|
Post by Bluebird on Jun 17, 2005 1:32:33 GMT -5
Hi Lizanne! I'm not quite sure what your question was, but I'd like to reflect on what you said. Observing balloons in flight, subject to wind currents and other things.....they soar together for a time, and sometimes they float off in different directions, still held by the bond of committment together You're so right. I think you were taking the analogue further. I was imagining two balloons ready to go off, one filled with helium and one with air. ;D But when you get to actually flying together, you let each other go their own ways, yet supporting each other by the knot that ties you together. So true. Yes I am. We have experienced exactly what you described in the balloons, and realized that personal freedom is such an important thing in a relationship, otherwise both sides get stuck and stop developing. And personal freedom does include respect, honesty and support.
|
|
|
Post by Ange on Jun 17, 2005 2:43:44 GMT -5
Hey Epinone
I'm an 80s sheila too! Sorry to hear about your marriage. I grew up in an abusive household so have some insight. I'm delighted you've now found such happiness/contentment/bliss whatever you want to call it! Rock on!
Ange
|
|
|
Post by Ange on Jun 17, 2005 2:44:29 GMT -5
Hey Lizanne
No worries. I misconstrue things all the time!
Ange
|
|
|
Post by lizanne333 on Jun 17, 2005 10:55:53 GMT -5
Bluebird says: . Man, bluebird: What a fresh air response to me today. I needed this. I don't know how I even have room to talk about relationships, as I have 2 failed marriages, and haven't dated in over 4 years, but somehow I have some sort of sense of how things could be......... I suspect that in your wisdom, having come together from a mutual attraction, where you have soared initially, the recognition that if you are "Always soaring", you burn the engines out. So, that would indicate to me that the bond of the golden ring before the All, or the KNOT, is the intent of both of you, when entering into this commitment., to allow your baloons to flow whereever they may, as each must have its freedom of growth, both personally, as well as spiritually, all the while, deep in the consciousness of each of the baloons is the "rememberance" of the commitment to the RING of Gold, or the KNOT of binding. Each baloon, because of its' love for the other, promotes its' own growth, and offers support to its' partner in this journey, that both baloons have the opportunity to remain at a similar level of growth, interdependent of each other, so as not to put too much stress on the tethers, or strings that are bound by the ring. So, I ask, does a relationship take work??? Hmmm If allowing is work, then I suppose so. I suspect the "work" is a sense of deep conscious monitoring, of where your baloons in their journey. Herein' lies the finesse. You need to be able to monitor the "position" of the baloons, like taking "stock", but then you must let go of the monitoring system, in order to "partake" of the "Milk and Honey" -the fruits of your commitment, The Fun, the moments of soul connection where you partake as One. I think that during these wonderful moments is also a good time to discuss how you observe the wonder of the success of your relationship, share notes, as well as discuss changes you would like to make. It is very difficult when there is a "problem" in one of the baloons to actually address it in the moment of the problem. Observe the problem, acknowledge it but wait until: the window to open where your love has reconnected, and discuss any problems at that time. Because if discussed at the time you are realizing and feeling the love for each other, then the problem can resolved inside of that moment of love. If you discuss the "problem" while both are in the moment of the problem, you have a tendency to be reactive, and entangle yourselves in a damaging manner, placing way too much stess on the "tethers" that are tied to the ring. Pray for the moment to come, and it will, if continually handled in this manner, where the two of you are consciouly connected "inside of your love' to address the issues....Can't stress ;D the importance of this. Sorry Edina, Carried On Again Kind of Wordy But I think this is so important to obtain sucess And I think, once the commitment has been made It is then: Quiet, periodical observation Adjustment of vision Allowing And of Course LOVE -Lizanne
|
|
|
Post by lizanne333 on Jun 17, 2005 11:11:17 GMT -5
Posted by eponine1971 on Yesterday at 23:37 Eponine says to Ange: My marriage was an abusive one that came from one surrender after another Lizanne says to both: Simply in these relationships the problem has been, "He has been the Sun, and you/I have been the moon revolving 'round the Sun supporting his light." I suspect, and I see that in a truly loving relationship, both parties need to allow each to be the Sun for awhile, and the other the moon......for does not the moon "grow" in power and resource and frustration, and need for self expression, while lying "seemingly repressed" while "serving the Sun?" We women know, and I am certain the men REALLY know the potential power residing in a female! They have been taught that they are to "steal" her power for his own sucess, and women have been taught to take a back seat and serve. This paradigm is OVER guys , and I mean that as the male guys If you GUYS reallllllllllllllllly wanna suceed, then allow the promotion of your women, and women, stop rushing to the rescue of the type of guy looking for their Mother to bake them cookies, and do their laundry and pay their bills and and and........share the light, and there is no please about it here, Got it?! Then the two of you will realllllllly fly! -Lizanne
|
|
|
Post by lizanne333 on Jun 17, 2005 11:39:44 GMT -5
Hopefully this post is appropriate in this location. It seems to address similar issues, MissE ;D
This is regarding the Masonic Order and its' Subservient Eastern Star.
I have a friend who is about to be installed as the Grand Duchess? of the Eastern Star.
It will blow your mind to hear what she told me.
Her emblem is a 5 sided star, upside down. I was perplexed when she told me this, so she explained to me that with the star upside down the "two leg" are pointing upwards, and she continued, like a "woman's legs" spread to the East to the "morning sun"
My mouth fell open, I couldn't believe what I was hearing.
She went on to explain the rites, where the women in formals, barefooted walk a path on the floor with two men present.
I listened in horror as she continued. She said she could feel the energy "from the configuration of the path" She laughed as she said, the men were oblivious to the energy of walking this path.
Now the women are not allowed to meet unless two men are present.
The men later have their meetings and women are not allowed.
Because the men do not have the capability of "pulling the energy and insight themselves" they exploit the women's capability of bringing in the "power if you will" then they absorb it, "steal" it and run off to their own conclave and discuss it and do whatever else they do.
Here is a prime example of the worst type of abuse of control, and exploitation I have just about ever heard of in my life.
The time is coming men, that the woman is to have her day, and it is scary for you because you must relinquish control. And this day is now. And not to worry in the letting go, really, you've nothing to be afraid of.
For a woman=wo(man) contains within her both male and female, no? Watch and see how a woman handles things with love, respect, honor and glory for all life.
Every man knows that it is his woman that allows him to sing...!
Get with the program, let go, and allow her to come forth.
Watch how she handles you and all things with an Eternal Wisdom, that you too can have, but STOP STEALING that which is not yours to steal!
It's either you get this, or we will just run you out of the way, but how nice it would be for you to partake, no? ;D
Yah, there is some bitterness here...But all is not lost, I know there is one man out there who understands these things, and is not threatened by the capabilities of a woman.
So this is dedicated to Leslie Parrish and all the women whose posts I have read in this location
Remember women, let go of the bitterness, that we may rule out of temperance!, and love.....
-Lizanne333
|
|
|
Post by guest on Jun 17, 2005 12:42:15 GMT -5
I don't think anybody "rules" anybody else.
|
|
|
Post by eponine1971 on Jun 17, 2005 13:38:18 GMT -5
Posted by eponine1971 on Yesterday at 23:37 Eponine says to Ange: My marriage was an abusive one that came from one surrender after another Lizanne says to both: Simply in these relationships the problem has been, "He has been the Sun, and you/I have been the moon revolving 'round the Sun supporting his light." I suspect, and I see that in a truly loving relationship, both parties need to allow each to be the Sun for awhile, and the other the moon......for does not the moon "grow" in power and resource and frustration, and need for self expression, while lying "seemingly repressed" while "serving the Sun?" We women know, and I am certain the men REALLY know the potential power residing in a female! They have been taught that they are to "steal" her power for his own sucess, and women have been taught to take a back seat and serve. This paradigm is OVER guys , and I mean that as the male guys If you GUYS reallllllllllllllllly wanna suceed, then allow the promotion of your women, and women, stop rushing to the rescue of the type of guy looking for their Mother to bake them cookies, and do their laundry and pay their bills and and and........share the light, and there is no please about it here, Got it?! Then the two of you will realllllllly fly! -Lizanne Lizanne, First of all, how dare you presume to know what happened in my relationship which was nothing like you said. It was not a struggle between man and woman. It was bad chemistry born from two people who started marriage half-baked and neither not knowing how to fill the roles of man and wife. I don't believe my ex-husband to be an evil person. And believe me, he certainly did not have the intelliegence to hatch a grand scheme to steal my power. From reading your posts, I suspect you have a very warped view of the relationship between men and women which has manifested itself in every aspect of your life and personal relationships. Leave that view to yourself but don't be so arrogant as to project it onto me. As to the Free Masons, you are wrong. I know this because my father was a member for a while. It is a very secret organisation that has had members like George Washington among other for-fathers. Now you friend has violated her order by telling you of their customs. Most of which are born from tradition dating back centuries. And what you might think of as a "transfer of power" is probably just old-time chilary when women were believed to need protection at all times. I am at peace with myself and my relationship. I do not need advice from over-zealous feminists who think anything womanly is a step backwards. Just as working full time does not make a woman a bad mother, staying home does not make me an anti-feminist. So don't tell me how to be what I have always been since the time I could walk and talk. Whatever my marriage may have been or not been, I have two beautiful children from it. How can I ever regret the union that gave me them?
|
|
|
Post by lizanne333 on Jun 17, 2005 16:51:53 GMT -5
guest says:
"I don't think anybody "rules" over anybody else.
Lizanne333 says:
I agree with you guest, however, in my own experience and many women I know, women have been trained to submit themselves in the relationship. Men have been trained to be dominant.
As a result, in my case, and "some" other women I know, the woman ends up giving up so much of her identity, and sense of who she is, in an effort to help her man "shine"
After many years of this, the woman may end up with no sense of self, depleted of energy from the giving.
She wakes up one day, and her man has gone, and she is left to clean up the mess, and attempt to pick up and carry on. Now she has to go through what one would call an identity crisis, and hopefully she makes it through.
Now, it can also work the other way. I have known of women who were the "sun", and the men are the moon, and the whole situation is reversed.....
So, each individual is responsible for their own interaction in the relationship, but when it falls apart the devastation is horrendous.
Ideally, as your comment reflects, two interdependent individuals coming forth into a relationship, brings about a shared responsibility in the relationship, where each contributes as equally as possible that they shine as ONE. This is not a brand new paradigm, however, there is a residual of the old paradigm remaining.
And it is I The Arrogant One, Sir Lizanne333
|
|
|
Post by eponine1971 on Jun 17, 2005 21:06:11 GMT -5
You're lucky I only said arrogant. Believe me, there were much more colorful words that came to mind.
|
|
|
Post by lizanne333 on Jun 17, 2005 22:10:10 GMT -5
Eponine71 says: Re: Leslie Parrish « Reply #86 on Today at 22:06 »
|
|
|
Post by lizanne333 on Jun 17, 2005 22:23:01 GMT -5
Now below is a wonderful understanding answer to a post where I had misunderstood the perspective of another. No anger, Ange just recognized her own mistakes in herself!
Re: Leslie Parrish « Reply #79 on Today at 3:44 »
|
|
|
Post by eponine1971 on Jun 18, 2005 0:38:37 GMT -5
Eponine71 says: Re: Leslie Parrish « Reply #86 on Today at 22:06 »
|
|